About NoVBM.com

This site reports news about absentee voting, and provides resources for those opposing the increased use of “No-excuse” absentee voting. This website is a response to the lack of organized opposition and resources on the web for those working to oppose vote by mail, absentee voting, and anything else that sounds like getting rid of voting booths and trusting the post office with Democracy. Please feel free to email me to help with this blog, [gentry (at) gentry lange. c o m]. Remember to rewrite the email with @ and no spaces.


gentry_100.gif
Gentry Lange
Director, The No Vote By Mail Project
gentry (at) gentry lange. c o m

18 Responses

  1. Wondering if you might have time for a radio interview with Dave Ross on KIRO? I can be reached via email tina.nole@gmail.com

    Thank you.

    • coucou, en effet tres belleJe viens de rentrer recemment apres qques annees a l etranger, pas la peine de te preciser que je suis egalement exeemmternt chaud!!Beau jeune homme de 25ans fraichement bronzé et atletique pr te servir fais moi signe

  2. Great blog with helpful info. I linked to it on my website.

  3. I appreciate your candid discussion. I can’t stand people who do not hesitate to point to problems without proposing a viable solution. I myself am not 100% convinced your solution (using only handcounted paper ballots by public secret vote) is the best solution, but it certainly ups the ante of difficulty to implement vote fraud.

  4. Thanks Ed, I do make a point of saying “hand auditing” is acceptable in large precincts, using a optical scan or similar solution which is on a paper ballot which is both hand and machine readable. Hand counts and hand audits are fine with me… the major point is to do them at the precinct level.

  5. Dear Mr. Lange,

    I suggested to my son, who is a senior at Nathan Hale High School in Seattle, that he volunteer with your efforts. I feel strongly also about this cause, and I may even be willing to contribute some time myself. My son has to volunteer at least 6 hours of work to a politically-oriented (or better yet, a civil liberties-oriented) organization. He may be the person that you need to research and obtain the non-profit status you seek. In addition, he and I are both musicians (I am a full-time professional and recording artist) and we may be able to help out in that way also.

    This is a very important issue….I have been involved in other voting rights organizations (verified voting, black box, etc.), and I was appalled that our citizens voted for mail-in voting. Even some of those who were aware of problems with e-voting somehow did not figure that an all mail-in system was filled with problems.

    Looking forward to hearing from you.

    Eric Madis

  6. I appreciate your efforts and would like to see a Constitutional challenge to vote by mail. I can imagine that some husband/wife has looked over a spouses shoulder and “helped” them vote. It seems to me this would be a Constitutional issue on several fronts depending on the facts and circumstances. Have you ever asked for anyone with this experience to contact you? Have you ever heard of anyone with this experience? If so, has anyone looked into the possibility of mounting a legal challenge?

    • That’s a clever answer to a tricky qutieson

    • in primele doua luni de sarcina am baut destul de multa bere zilnic 1-2 sticle. ecografia de 14 sapatamani nu a relevat nimic anormal. care pot fi efectele invizibile (care nu se pot detecta prin ecografie) ale alcoolului asupra fatului?traiesc intr-o panica cumplita si nu am idee cat de grave pot fi eventualele probleme. am citit si de retard mintal dar nu stiu in ce forma?Va multumesc.

  7. Surprisingly I agree with you, but would like to see what you propose regarding this. During the 1992 election I was a service member stationed at Ft. Campbell, KY. At that time the base hosted about 22,000 soldiers and then of course their families. Registering to vote by absentee ballot in the military is pretty much the only way service members can vote and they do a good job of promoting it. However, our absentee ballots didn’t arrive in the mail until two weeks (actually 16 days) after the election. I actually drove home to IL to vote and had to sign a waiver stating that I had registered absentee but my ballot had not arrived. I got out of the military in ’96 so it wasn’t a problem anymore, but the way I saw it Clinton won an election that he may not have been entitled to. Most military members were anti Clinton. I have spoken to service members that said that in 2008 the absentee ballots were received over two weeks after the election and in some cases, not at all (12 service members stationed in Germany at the time). I would like to see something different set up for service members and their families to vote that are serving away from their home polling place. They have a right to vote and I think it is especially important considering that the person elected is their Commander and Chief.

    • I think we should set-up polling places with the same rules and protections for soldiers and consider them outlying precincts for major elections.

  8. New No Vote By Mail candidate for Washington Secretary of State just announced.

    http://www.murray4sos.org.

  9. I tried to contact you via your email address but it got rejected due to not being a good address. Is there another way to contact you?

  10. Will you (I hope) be sharing your research with legislators in Wyoming, who are being lobbied to adopt VBM even now?

  11. Regarding permanent Vote-by-mail (VBM AKA no excuse absentee voting) you post an article which is filled with bad logic. Obviously, they are not trying to give a balanced view of the advantages and disadvantages, from the website NO VBM.

    https://novbm.wordpress.com/2008/02/20/whats-wrong-with-voting-by-mail-or-absentee-ballot/

    I will review each of their points below.

    1. YES, AN ISSUE. “Absentee ballots are not fully secret because you may not have a situation where you can vote in private”:
    Yes, that is understood. But in all such systems, there is usually a option to go in and vote in person. That will not go away and if you have a severe situation say at home at the kitchen table, then you can vote in person, sometimes even after you have send in your VBM ballot. In reality, most people PREFER the experience of voting, and enjoy working through the ballot with family members, making this more like a take-home test rather than a pop quiz.

    2. NONISSUE: Absentee ballots are still counted by machines from just a few private companies.
    This really has nothing to do with whether the voting is VBM or not. So to bring this issue into the comparison is false logic. It’s like wondering if power steering is a good idea in cars and then saying it isn’t because it is in the same polluting cars as mechanical steering. False logic.

    3. NONISSUE: Can be sorted by 3rd parties.
    Again, has nothing really to do with whether the ballots were completed in-person (esp. if the county uses voting centers, which is the trend now). Any of the ballots could be sorted or handled by 3rd parties. Bad logic.

    4. NONISSUE “Cost can be higher in VBM systems.”
    Maybe, but most argue it is less expensive, esp if polling places are not used at all.
    Does not mean the method is no good, and in the age of coronavirus, cost is hardly the issue here.

    5. YES, AN ISSUE, BUT IT IS FOR ALL VOTING SYSTEMS. “Signature Verification Process is error prone and routinely disenfranchises thousands of voters when it is used.” —
    Yes, it is imperfect, but it runs both ways. It may also allow voters who are not valid as well. We need better standards for signature verification and other identification methods. This really gets back to a core issue with voter validation. Do we use a voter ID, biometrics, etc. to validate voters? VBM voting can also be argued that it is pretty good at validation because each ballot is sent directly to the specific voter and they sign it. In-person voting, in theory, you could impersonate different people over and over. VBM voting you have to get another VBM ballot to do that, so it is harder.

    6. MOSTLY NOT AN ISSUE: “Voter Suppression, Vote Buying, Vote Stuffing become far easier in this system.” — We have to break this up.
    a) Voter suppression – is absolutely not true, because most voter suppression scams such as gaming voting stations or machines that are available resulting in long lines disappears completely. So this is false.
    b) Vote Buying – Is illegal, but indeed you could easily buy a vote. But honestly, this is the least of our problems, and it can be done with in-person voting, because you can vote and take a picture of your ballot. We have a hard time getting people to vote at all. Such vote buying schemes really are not worth trying to defeat this way. So vote buying is not impossible to stop no matter what but is actually pretty rare.
    c) Vote stuffing – In a way, this is true, but it is known as VBM harvesting, where activists go to rest homes etc. and encourage people to vote and then pick up the ballots. No harm done there unless they also modify them like the case in NC recently where the ballots were modified. But with ballots either mailed and tracked, which is the current proposed law, or the ballots are dropped of at collection centers, this hazard largely disappears.

    7. NONISSUE: Accidental double voting. Could occur but election systems are designed not to count ballots cast by the same voter. Only one is counted.

    8. NONISSUE: VBM does not increase participation.
    Some may say this, but no one said we were entertaining VBM just to get participation up. On the contrary, most people find that it is easier and better to vote by mail because they have more time to consider the options on the ballot, and encourages more down-ballot voting.

    9. NOT WITH TRACKING: Post office can lose or misplace it for years.
    This is thwarted by the tracking being proposed which will track every ballot sent to and returned from every voter.

    10. TRUE BUT NOT BAD. Alters the precinct system and changes the culture.
    True, and may be a downside, but coronavirus is already doing it and this is not necessarily a bad the results are still reported by precinct.

    11. TRUE BUT HARMLESS. VBM systems increases the time it takes to count the election.
    This is mainly due to the signature verification phase. Yes, this is true. But that does not mean it does not work.

    12. TRUE BUT HARMLESS. VBM replaces election day and replaces with with election month. Is that a bad thing?

    13. DITTO Again, talking about election month and that it changes the calendar of the election. We need to adapt.

    14. TRUE, but up to the voter.
    In a presidential primary, voters may vote for candidates that have dropped out. Easy to fix by returning the VBM ballot on election day.
    It is also true that some states don’t get to vote on candidates that drop out.

    15. TRUE FOR ALL VOTING SYSTEMS. Rigging is possible and people have gone to jail. Yes, and it is true also for precinct voting.

    16. NOT TRUE WITH TRACKING. The margin of error is unknown such as delivery rate or loss (This will go away with active tracking) missing signatures are a problem (but voters can resolve it, and we can’t cover for voters who don’t follow directions. Returning to collection points where signatures are checked can reduce this). No numbers of too late arriving ballots (not true with tracking systems). Overvotes can’t be corrected (True, this is a benefit to in-person voting IF they use a voting machine that checks for overvotes, many areas (San Diego) have in-precinct voting that does not do any checking, so the same errors are made in both cases)

    17. Repeat of item 1.

    18. HARMLESS. Processing is more complex. True but not really relevant.

    What this article did not do was summarize the BENEFITS of VBM voting:
    1. Voters can vote at their own pace, as it is more like a take-home test rather than a pop quiz. Don’t know how to vote? You can look things up on line and discuss with friends and you can fill out your ballot as you go. This means more down-ballot contests will be voted.
    2. Coronavirus social distancing friendly. This is critically important!
    3. Climate-change friendly. No need to drive to a precinct location, esp. in rural areas.
    4. Voter suppression by changing voting locations or days, reducing machines, etc is not possible.
    5. Ballots can be dropped off at collection centers to gain security and the newest proposals include post-office tracking.

    BOTTOM LINE: VBM voting is not a bad option but will require some changes in how states are used to handling the election.

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